12 Great Reader Comments on Career

I love cupofjo so much that I check here multiple times a day, excitedly awaiting a new post! I would love to see a bit more posts on interesting careers and transitions – specifically creative careers and self starter women. I’m an textile artist in a small city currently paying the bills by working in HR, and I am always wondering how I will transition to a more creative field (aka starting my own business). I would love some cupofjo inspiration and guidance on “making a living”!

loooong time reader, love the blog. here’s what I want to know – what should we (women) do if we follow all best practices for negotiating a raise and are not only not given one or at least an appropriate one but are also punished for even asking and by a female boss? I did everything suggested in the section above and I did a ton of research before making my case to my boss. I was given a promotion to a director level position that was overdue and a 5% raise which amounted to a $2300 increase annually. I asked for 10% thinking that was reasonable for the level I was moving into (and not that much percentage-wise) and when I had asked for this promotion a year prior I was told that I deserved it but my boss didn’t feel like she had the money to pay me appropriately. I was pretty shocked that this is what she felt was appropriate. AND I know for a fact that the male directors make more than I do although I oversee the largest department and make the most revenue for my organization. My boss is the only one above me and she makes 125 times my salary! What is recommended as recourse when you suspect there is wage gap discrimination but you work for a small organization with essentially no HR in which to voice direct complaints too? How do you address a boss who promotes salary confidentially and punishes you if you reveal that you know what others make (because they’ve told you) in order to advocate for yourself?
How do you bounce back when a boss, especially a female boss, isn’t as supportive as the example in this post and continue to advocate for yourself? I read time and time again about what we should do to advocate for ourselves professionally, but I want to know what to do if we try those things and fail (but we are succeeding and excelling at work). And if we suspect there is discrimination happening and we are a small (10 person) non-profit team (i.e. not major HR structure to support complaints)? Thanks!

I’ve eliminated “sorry” from my workplace vocabulary.
Inspired by something I read (probably here!) about how often women say ‘sorry’ inappropriately, I stopped apologizing in emails.
Obviously, if I do something wrong, I own the mistake and work towards fixing it. But there’s no more “Sorry I didn’t get this to you sooner …”, “Sorry I can’t meet with you next week …”, etc.
Removing that word from my vocabulary has made me recognize that I don’t want to hear excuses from others – I just want the information I need as soon as I can get it so that I can move on with my work. And this tiny change in tone in my work communications makes me feel more powerful in my role, keeps email threads more professional, and, surprisingly, has eliminated self-inflicted anxiety/guilt that I’m not measuring up to others’ expectations.

Give credit where credit is due! It’s so important to me that when one of my employees does something but I’m the one passing it up the chain, I tell my boss who did the work, especially if they thank me for it. Or if you’re in a meeting, don’t be the person who takes credit for someone else’s idea—that should only happen in movies. And equally important, don’t allow others to take credit for your work. If you have a coworker who consistently does this, develop a strategy to get around this (cc’ing your manager on the email with your portion of the project, actively talking about what you’re working on, etc.) No one else will fight this battle for you, and it will be important when listing the major projects of the year for salary review.

Oooh, these are all so good! I especially love Eva’s comment about keeping a list of accomplishments. I used to keep a kudos folder in my inbox – it was an easy way to keep track of compliments I’d received and was super helpful in preparing for my annual review. I’ve gotten away from this practice, and a friend recently mentioned that she was doing it so I was inspired to start again. It’s so helpful to have an ongoing record of what’s going well, every win, every nice thing someone has said – especially for a new business owner who could use a little encouragement on the daily.

“Listing accomplishments is something I see as a year-round project. Any successes, praise, side projects or unexpected turns I handle throughout the year, I write down immediately. A Google document, email draft, note on your phone or anywhere you can track these will be helpful. I’m always amazed how much I forget over the course of the year.” — Eva

I read this comment when it was first posted and it has changed the way I viewed myself throughout the year. As someone who holds a role that can be seen as less than (I’m an Executive Assistant, an excellent one mind you), I have found it hard over the years to add up all the things I’ve done that could be seen as ‘above and beyond’ in my position. But since I read that comment, I started keeping a Word doc of major things I’ve worked on during 2017 and now that we are approaching year end reviews, I already have a substantial list of accomplishments ready to go instead of doubting myself as I wrack my brain to remember why I’m a valuable member of my team.

Always appreciate this site and its beautiful readers.

Love this! Especially Steph’s grandma.

Let me also chime in… I often hear this cheerful “just ask for what you want” and don’t let it stop you just because you are a woman. Well, it’s a little less cheerful if you have had more negative experiences, which we as women, typically do and then we end up just put those experiences away in a box and move on. When asking my company that recently started a policy on remote work for that one day of work-from-home, as per policy, I was grilled about childcare when none of my male colleagues were asked those questions (not all were dads, but what about their work-out schedules? or car wash schedules? it sounds abstract and a little crazy, but why ask the one woman about childcare). Similarly, with the pay negotiations, sometimes when asking for too much, women might appear too pushy and an offer is rescinded where for a male, this might be seen as a strong and positive trait.

I just think, real life sometimes is a bit harsher, then all those cheerful proclamations. For example, the “just show up and do hard work” – I did that for years, and was rewarded with pay raises and good reviews, but now, as a mom of two, also caring for an elderly mother, I frankly cannot give a damn, I show up, absolutely do my work, but nothing beyond that, and guess, what? I still get my % raise that everybody else gets. Sometimes, just showing up and doing bare minimum is a-okay too, if life gets to be too much. It’s a struggle and you have to be fluid to change with it but don’t kill yourself over it.

Just read a tweet that gives excellent advice “you are much more likely to get what you ask for than what you deserve” https://twitter.com/icecrime/status/680020061977849856

When faced with a difficult colleague I immediately remind myself of one or two things – they are someone’s parent and/or they are someone’s child. It’s super weird, but by thinking this I tell myself that they are truly loved by SOMEONE and how can I ‘hate’ someone who is someone else’s mother, father, daughter, son. For whatever reason this helps me curb my frustration, anger, annoyance etc. almost every time.

I have a post-it stuck to the bottom of one of my computer screens saying “DINTR?”- Do I Need To Respond? It has helped me SO MUCH, particularly when I receive infuriating and occasionally inflammatory emails. There’s a person in my company who thrives on angering other people, and has made it his special mission to do this to me. Not responding to some of his emails has saved my sanity, and made me more respected by his line manager, and mine.
Other pieces of advice:
1. TAKE YOUR ANNUAL LEAVE. ALL of it. It’s there, you’re paid for it, and holiday days are important for your mental health. TAKE IT.
2. Find a way to make yourself feel confident at work, and go with it. For me, it’s wearing heels- I feel more confident when I’m wearing them, and this helps people take me more seriously- which is important to me, as a young (and small!) woman in a pretty senior position (I’m eight years younger than anyone else in my team).
3. Never be afraid to ask for advice. From anyone! I ask my boss, her colleagues, my colleagues, my dad for work advice ALL THE TIME. Everyone has other, valuable experiences that you might be able to draw on in your own role, even if their jobs are different
4. Don’t date work colleagues…! I’ve done it three times and every time it’s ended with awkwardness and difficulty. LESSON LEARNED! (Though I’ll admit to knowing people who have very happy, successful relationships from meeting people at work, so maybe it’s just me haha!)

My advice would be to trust yourself and stand up for what you want, while at the same time learning when to pick your battles and let things go. You can’t always win, so you need to ask yourself if this thing is really that important, and whether letting this go might mean you have the ability to really fight for something more important later on down the line.
Also, be kind and help people when you can (without being a pushover). You never know when you might need to call in a favour.

Absolutely love these!
I would add: don’t send that email if you’re frustrated/cross/ upset/overwhelmed. Sleep a night and not only will you read it differently in the morning, but you’ll give a much better response.

Loved these tips! Before one of the biggest deal negotiations of my career as a young tech executive, our CEO leaned over to me and whispered… “Just remember, they can’t kill us.” Not only did it lighten the mood but I think of that every time I head in to a high stakes meeting. Suck it up and be brave because what’s the worst that could happen!? Generally, death is not in the list.

I’m 26 and have been in the workforce for about four years now. I agree whole heartedly with the advice in your post.

The only piece that I would add to this that has helped me a person and in my career is get a mentor. Not just one but many. I used to get so nervous talking to more experienced people, afraid that I was bugging them until I finally realized they had all been where I am now. It’s a great position to be in because most of the time you aren’t in professional competition with these folks and they have nothing to lose by giving you advice and insight. I have been able to talk through career change and life changes with them. I’ve found myself asking them for advice on office politics, 401k’s, and even work life balance. Mentors come in all shapes and sizes, make sure you take the time to talk with folks after meetings or follow up with them after a great conversation.

Anyway that’s my two cents! Thank you for writing this blog it’s like having a cool big sister that has all the answers. It really is something special.

Re: On Owning a Mistake–my former (super successful) male boss gave me some advice that I think works in the corporate male-dominated world: Don’t point out your own errors (unless it is necessary). 9 out of 10 times no one will notice and it doesn’t matter.

What a great post! I would love to see this idea turned into a series!

This is so informative, and these reader comments are turning into the best advice column! I love learning about success in the workplace from other women who have tried it all. I love Ramona’s comment about holding her job for her big skills and her valued ability to unjam the copier. I’ve been thinking a lot on how to balance the playing field and firmly hold our place in the work force. I wrote about it while I was browsing for jobs this summer!

https://thewonderof.co/2017/08/22/10-ways-to-get-ahead-and-get-the-job/

This is not popular or conventional advice, but a beloved mentor who is the tip-top of his profession nationally once told me “Never ask for more money when you’re offered a job. It starts things off on the wrong note. Take the job, then be so good that people start asking what they need to pay to keep you. If you’re good enough, they will just start handing you money.” This has worked well for me: focusing on work product instead of work politics gives you exit options, which raises your value internally.

When offered a job in my highly competitive industry, I followed this advice and said, “I’d be absolutely delighted to join you. My one concern is that you do not have a written maternity leave policy. If you can commit to six months in writing, I will be delighted to accept right now, with no further negotiation on salary or other terms.” I probably left $10,000 on the table, but enjoyed every second with my baby when she came two years later. My employer has provided substantial annual raises each year since, without me asking – exactly as my mentor predicted.

PLAN FOR RETIREMENT. I know people who are 65 and will have to work until they die because they didn’t do this.

When I was 12 my dad hired a salesman who was 82. The man was very spry and energetic. It made a big impression on me that a person could work as long as they wanted. My father would always encourage me to try a job and not be concerned how long it lasted because even after one day I’d have more experience than I had the day before. Throughout his life he had many different jobs and also worked into his 80’s.

This is wonderful. Thank you!

I work at a university and, a few years ago, attended a ‘negotiating your faculty position’ workshop. In a discussion about gender differences in negotiating behaviour, one of the panelists made a remark that has stayed with me. She explained that her female employees tended to be very reluctant to self-advocate in areas of salary, benefits etc., but that she witnessed those same people tenaciously and skillfully going to bat for their children when on the telephone with their schoolteachers, sports coaches, or doctors. While I don’t have children, I have noticed this with people I supervise at work. It feels so much more natural to push for a raise for them than for me, so now I try and pretend I’m in that role when I’m having those conversations for myself. It’s still not fun, but a little less mortifying!

I recently began a job search due to relocation. I’m entering at a different place in my career and a different point in the economy than in previous searches. I’ve always just been relieved to find a job and have rarely been in the position to be super choosy. I realized a couple of things: one is that you are interviewing the potential job just as they are interviewing you. It doesn’t have to feel like a one way street. Second, just because an offer is good or better than what you’ve been offered before doesn’t mean you have to take it. I found myself so “flattered” by a generous offer for a job I didn’t really want that I almost took it. I realized it was like feeling like you have to go on a date with the captain of the football team because you should be flattered he asked, when in reality you’re not really into him. Realizing your worth can be a hard lesson ( in both jobs and dating ;))

I wear a cuff bracelet that is inscribed with Draw The Line on the inside to remind myself to have work boundaries. Health care is a 24/7 operation and it will follow you everywhere if you let it. Making sure that my superiors and the staff that I supervise know that my personal time is non-negotiable has become my number one priority. One simple thing that helps: Change your personal voicemail with the hours you will respond to calls and be an enforcer of your own time.