The Secret to Female Friendship

Bridesmaids Maya Rudolph Kristen Wiig


when harry met sally

I had female friends growing up, but in my thirties I started feeling much closer to the women I knew. At first, I wasn’t sure why this lovely intimacy was developing, but then I read this piece from New York Magazine and had a lightbulb moment…

The secret to deeper female friendship? Doing something RANDOM.

Says New York Magazine:

Twentysomething friendships involve long, late nights, all-day walks, and hours-long phone conversations. But having friends in your 30s is functionally impossible. There is no good time to see people, no friend equivalent of the candlelit dinner and rose-strewn canopy bed. To stay friends is to make do with the social equivalent of a taco truck and bathroom quickie. As the opposite of a sensualist, I actually prefer this. There’s something both efficient and exciting about having friends woven into the texture of daily life. It feels almost illicit when we manage to steal time together, like we are cheating on our grown-up lives….

What’s more, low expectations can be liberating. “When a friend comes to the grocery store with me because it’s what I have to do, the pressure to be fun evaporates,” says my friend Liesl. “Then we can just walk down the aisles and I can complain about the domestic shackles of having to make dinner and maybe get recipe ideas or maybe not, but somehow that kind of environment — purposeful, practical — allows me to be far more myself. And in that headspace — which is also key to feeling close to someone — the conversation organically weaves from the price of granola to something about my marriage to something I’ve read to petty gossip. And I feel way better after, especially since I got my groceries, too.”

That point rang so true for me. In my twenties, I always scheduled dinners with friends. Now in our thirties, with more time constraints, we still sometimes have dinner but more often we’ll meet up in casual ways: to run an errand or take a walk or get a pedicure or go shopping for a birthday present for one of our moms.

Although our meet-ups are less ceremonious, they’re actually awesome. There’s something about random activities that accelerates intimacy, since they take the pressure off any sort of performance. Low-key time together reminds me of hanging out with family, so your friends begin feeling like sisters. “These days instead of meeting someone for coffee, even if it’s a work thing, I suggest that we walk,” my friend Gemma told me. “So much more fun.”

Thoughts? What do you do with your friends? Do you do random activities (bookstore browsing, dog walking, Trader Joe’s runs), or do you prefer more structured plans, like dinner and a movie?

P.S. Five-minute phone calls, Mindy Kaling on friendship and starting an articles club.

This is part of a series called “What We’re Reading“—featuring interesting articles on different topics we find during the week. See more here, if you’d like.

  1. Natalia says...

    Yes! This is it! What I’ve always wanted is the SEINFELD KIND OF FRIENDSHIP!!!!

  2. Gaby says...

    We train for marathons. Fine, sometimes that means get togethers are at 5am, but sometimes it’s 6am on a Sat for 4-5hrs! I’m injured and haven’t been able to run almost all yr – I sure miss my friends.

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  4. I maintain some of my closest friendships with letter writing. Not emailing, not necessarily even texting (though we do do that on occasion)—but good old-fashioned letters. It’s the equivalent of our old “long talks,” but on whatever schedule works for each of us. Weirdly, I’ve been able to keep friends closer this way although physically they’re

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  6. Yes! I actually started a blog to my best friend because we live so far apart and always miss each other’s phone calls. When we do connect with each other, there is always an emergency involving a screaming child in the background. Still, I think of her everyday and we are parallel parenting miles away.

  7. tunie says...

    Except when your friend is only available to meet for HER errands…This happened to me and for a long while I conceded that with two children, maybe she was busier. Was it selfish to feel that she might respect my time as well and occasionally come on one of my errands? I felt undervalued as a friend because of this, even though it sounds rather petty writing it out here. But wouldn’t she have enjoyed a mini break from her own agenda on occasion? I ended up feeling somewhat used for my companionship due to our visits only ever happening on her terms, (this, after over a year of double-duty visits). I miss her, but my needs were not being met or acknowledged.

  8. I just wrote a little post on female friendship, and it got me thinking even more about the relationships with our women friends. This article is to spot on! We have no time in our thirties! We move to suburbs, different cities, grow our careers, get pregnant, etc. My friend Kelly and I started an early morning walking tradition on Saturdays. We walk for about 2 hours from 7am-9am. It’s a great work out and opportune time to unload everything on our minds.

    Thanks for this post, very intuitive. Here’s mine if you are interested!


  9. Joyce says...

    I know this blog post is a few months old but I still wanted to comment!

    My favorite thing to do with a close girlfriend is take a fitness class together. We’re by no means the fastest/strongest in class and it takes the pressure off. We can cheer each other on or keep pace with each other when the other is feeling sluggish.

  10. Dear Joanna,

    I really loved what you did here!

    I shared this article on my latest Link Love blog entry ( as I found it especially fitting to the theme of a new beginning (I just moved into a new apartment and finally have the space and independence to continue working on my friendships with long-time & new-found friends). I really hope you don’t mind me sharing your post.

    Do keep up the great work and photos in this space! :)

    Laced Ivory – Style, Beauty & Lifestyle

    P.S. Love that When Harry Met Sally pic!

  11. I love this piece! It’s so true and right on about the change from our 20’s to 30’s-you nailed it. Great site and well-written content. Would love your feedback on mine if you have a moment to swing by. -jessie

  12. I seriously love this post because I can relate so well… But a part of me hates this post because I’m still in my early twenties. Anyone who knows me tells me I’m an “old soul.” My friends go to bars and clubs on weekends but I stay home doing DIY’s or watching Caillou reruns. On week days they do lunch dates while I visit my dad, make dinner, or redecorate my bathroom (all things that oddly enough give me a ton of excitement). I don’t make appointments to see friends, I rarely even plan a Friday night.. Buy I do love our random encounters. Going shopping or to the supermarket together. Even when they come sit in my kitchen with me as I cook dinner.

    I only have one friend my age who lives a lifestyle similar to mine. Shes my newest friend but we’ve become extremely close and maybe this is why. We’re always pretty busy taking care of our families so any time we spend together is pretty random, and it’s probably the quickest most intimate friendship I’ve ever built.

  13. I live in the same area on even condo building as many close friends. I love doing “the loop” in the neighbourhood with our dogs, or walking to Wholefoods to run errands. Friendship in my 30s is much deeper because we have more to share…maybe more grit. We are all simply more interesting in our 30s I guess…the 20s was a blur of fun times, but the best part of life is now more about the day to day stuff. What you say in this blog is really true.

  14. My female friends are very important to me and I try to make time once a month to see them. I don’t have children but my partner takes up a lot of my time as we rarely see each other in the week so weekends are golden time. However, whatever life throws at you girlfriends are always there to listen and probably make a few jokes to lighten any mood. Also, who else can I drink a bottle of wine with and not feel guilty! Girlfriends are the best friends!

  15. S. says...

    Man, I’m in my twenties and even though I’m not married with kids, it’s so hard to see my friends since we go to different schools, work in different places, go to different gyms.. It’s crazy! So yeah, I feel you. I got together with one of my girlfriends for lunch yesterday in between some work errands and it almost felt like cheating on our responsibilities, even if we have lunch hours so why not get together?

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  17. I”m in my twenties and it just so happens that me and all my friends have finally moved back home after college/grad school/first jobs. Our schedules are pretty different so we hang out by going for a walk. Whoever can make it shows up. Sometimes a walk turns into grabbing salads or coffee. The other activity that really works is volunteering at each other’s work events. I’d be happy to continue or expand this sort of social life in my 30’s!

  18. I don’t believe it’s an issue of age, it’s an issue of a life stage. I am in my late 20’s, married, no children. All of our friends are married with infants and toddlers.

    Parenting impacts free time. Women in their 30’s are more likely to be married and have small children, which limits free time considerably–especially for an American mother. (Moms in the U.S. have ten minutes of time by themselves in a day on average, I believe).

    If you’re in 30s and you don’t have children, you have significantly more flexibility and freedom. You’re more likely to go out at your leisure and see friends. You can make plans for dinner and a movie. That’s not as easy or realistic if you’re a parent.

  19. I love how much I relate to this with my friends and I’m only 23. Perhaps we all a lot more busy than we realise.

  20. Just today during my lunch break, I needed to go to the hair store to buy some clip-in extensions for an upcoming wedding (fun/scary idea – I have never worn them before, but I am really excited to try it) and a friend met me there. Mostly I wanted her help with matching the color, but it turned into a really fun lunch hour trying on wigs. Then we both went back to work!

  21. I have a job where I travel, either all around town, out of town overnight, or where I day trip only to pull in on two tires to get my 12 yr old before aftercare closes!
    I have had a hard time growing friendships and certainly developing new ones. Everyone is busy! I feel like crashing when I’m home or obligated to do household chores and errands. Now I know to invite a friend for errands or just hang out while doing laundry!

  22. @kate love your comment. every word spoke true for me. love the porch and wine on hand idea =)

  23. Im finding the opposite. my 20s friendships seem to be able to float much easier and those last minute errands or get togethers or “lets go get a drink right this minute” seemed easier cause no one was married or had kids or households to manage.
    now i find that trying to spontaneously meet up never works. myself or the other usually can’t make it. it has to be scheduled, planned weeks in advance. we’ve managed but its rare that both are free to run and get a pedicure at the same time. although that sounds lovely if it worked out! lol so I’ve noticed friendships have become much much harder to maintain and for me to be more intentional about them. i love and NEED my friends but it sometimes feels hard.

  24. I don’t know. I still think it’s important to get AWAY from your duties and just spend quality YOU time, but with friends (alone is important to, but I also think spending quality time with people outside your family is very valuable. You don’t want to be stuck in a bubble). I don’t want to give up occasional happy hours or dinners with friends anytime soon. It’s too much fun. If you are feeling “unnatural” about it – perhaps the friendship isn’t the right fit.

  25. Whenever my friend and I get together, we always happen upon historical sites or reenactments. It’s just how it always happens and we laugh/try to figure out if it was on purpose or not. We live in different cities on the east coast, so it’s pretty easy to find that kind of stuff. It makes it feel like we were never apart.

  26. now in my late 30’s, working full-time and having two small children i find that picking up the phone on the way to or from work to chat for even 10 minutes has been a great way to connect. i talk to my one friend just about every day even if it’s super brief. As for other friends we have some ‘girls’ nights’ – quick dinner, late drink, brunch. Not all the friends can make it and that’s alright but we try to scheduled it monthly to keep it going just so we can all stay in touch as best as we can.

  27. I find this sort of sad! Just like “me time”, it’s really important to nurture personal connections with quality, undivided attention. Also, I would feel totally miffed to have to rely on fly-by plans with zero commitment.

  28. So interesting! The only thing is, as a writer with a full-time job, I don’t run errands anymore, hahaha. I order everything I need, from toiletries to groceries to clothes, off the internet. I do go to yoga but I have no friends in my neighborhood that would use the same yoga studio. On the weekends sometimes we’ll go to the park with our friends, but that is also always planned, plus it’s a “couples” thing. I’m still going to enjoy my girlfriend dinners and drinks, but will have to think about how I can incorporate this into my life also.

  29. this is why i cannot have a limited data plan. my gfs are now scattered and our text threads are PRICELESS. happy hours are great, but man… sometimes the random text at 10pm is the best…

  30. Great post, Joanna! I’ve never been really good at maintaining my female friendships. I should really try harder.

  31. When my first son was a baby I had a friend that I liked and wanted to know better who lived in my neighborhood. I would call her up and we would go for hours long walks that maybe took us to a coffe shop and maybe not. During those walks our friendship moved from casual to deep and rooted. It morphed in a way that other social settings would never have allowed it to.

  32. I am at the end of my thirties and still regularly have scheduled dates with my friends and long phone calls in addition to the drive by. It’s important to me, so I make the time.

  33. Hi everyone!
    I actually believe the secret to female friendship is less of an age thing and more of a life similarity thing: it comes with kids (or their lack) in your 30’s. You stop obsessing over every little thing about yourself and start worrying about bigger things, so all the time you can get off and manage to sneak a date or a superficial moment feels like a treat.
    I think that that lack of selfishness – better said, of egocentrism – allows you to better appreciate your friends, their struggles and not feel resentment towards their lack of time for you.
    (or maybe this is just my experience ;)))

  34. I think either I’m just not this type of person, or I’m not at that stage in my life yet. I casually text to my friends all the time but without regular, in-depth conversations over the phone or a meal, it just doesn’t feel like we’ve truly connected. It’s kind of the way I’ll text and email with my mom constantly throughout the week but if we haven’t had a solid, 45-minute phone conversation then she insists we set a time and talk.

  35. I love this! I am in my mid-twenties and I find that it’s getting harder and harder to find time with friends. I can’t imagine how it’s going to be once I get married with little ones.

  36. This rings so true for me! But I also think (at least in my experience) that it has a lot to do with your situation. Eg, I’m in my late twenties with two littles, which has made me definitely appreciate the shorter, random friend hang outs. But most of the women I do this with are also mothers. My girlfriends who don’t have children still plan the dinners etc and I just find those so much harder to go to! I think our different lives, despite being the same ages, have forced us to think about friendship and getting together differently. And now that we do it differently it’s harder than it used to be to get together.

  37. I’m in my late twenties, but a shift is definitely happening. Sometime I’ll see a friend for half an hour just to go get a loaf of bread from a nice bakery. It’s so true that you get to a point where you almost have to “steal” time.

  38. I love this! So true–as life gets busy, random encounters are the most authentic way to meet up with girlfriends. This writing is inspiring–thank you!
    Caroline Schley

  39. Amazing article. Strikes the truth. Really enjoyed reading it :)

  40. I guess I’m lucky because I’ve had friendships like this since college. My favorite quotidian activities to do with friends is grocery shopping, watching Law and Order SVU reruns, cleaning, and walking the trails. And yes, I did say cleaning. Once my friend and I scrubbed her stove top with baking soda and hydrogen peroxide. She lived in a college apartment and the stove top was so gross you didn’t even know it was white until a bottle of wine and quite a few hours later.

  41. My bestie and I are both breastfeeding all the time (me, twins. Her, a hungry hungry newborn) so later this week I am grabbing sushi and she is getting wine and we will gorge ourselves for an hour before we go back to our babies. Random activities sure do create intimacy!

  42. I’m 26, but my 27 year old best friend and I just had a gleeful time shopping for household supplies at Target together, sharing coupons and finding deals like grandmothers. It’s just being real together on a new level.

  43. This is such an interesting read – coming from a girl in her twenties! Haha it is so spot on that most of my rendezvous are planned dinners, coffee dates, movie nights, but there are those occasional gym meet ups, shopping hauls, or grocery shopping. However, I live in southern NJ and we have the convenience of the beach and boardwalks so often I have many beach hangouts with my friends, or go for a walk on the Boardwalk. But I can do anything from sitting in silence to going to a fancy outing with some of my closest friends!

  44. I agree with Shira! I know you have posted a little on this before, but would love more tips and ideas on how to make new friends in a new city, or even an old :)

  45. I have this motto that true friendship lies in the minutiae. I find that because I don’t get to see friends as often anymore, all of our time together is spent “catching up” on the big stuff. I can see someone for the first time in years and the only thing I seem able to say is, “Hmm…what have I been doing? Well, we bought a house, got married, got a dog, and had a baby.” Fifteen years recapped in ten seconds. When you see people more often, even if it’s for a shorter amount of time, you’re generally more up to date with the goings on of their life, and that’s when friendship can blossom.

    Like you said, growing up, my friends and I would talk on the phone for hours, or even literally sit there on the phone watching tv together and only speaking once in a while to comment on what we were watching. In college we’d lay around on the floor of each other’s dorms, listening to music, reading magazines, and generally just shootin’ the shit. There’s not nearly enough of an opportunity to just shoot the shit with people as you get older. I think that type of friendship is so much more organic and enjoyable than the “I might be able to do dinner sometime next month” that I experience in my 30’s. I think it’s probably much better to try for shorter but more frequent meet ups, where there’s less pressure to perform. I also feel like doing an activity together helps with any potential awkward silences that you might have if you’re sitting across from each other at dinner.

    I also personally love the pop in, when someone just randomly knocks on our door because they were walking past. It so rarely happens because everyone’s so afraid they’re imposing, but if I’m honest with myself, the chances are good that I’m not actually too busy to enjoy one spontaneous glass of wine.

    We recently started trying to make an effort to sit out on our front stoop (as opposed to the back patio) and we’re always amazed at how many people we know who walk past. My sister even decided to keep a case of wine in the house so they can always offer a glass to their neighbors when they’re sitting out on their porch.

  46. Walking with friends is one of my very favorite favorite things! I’ve never tried the grocery store trip, but that also sounds awesome.

  47. I just want to thank you, Joanna, for being a sweet and strictly positive corner of the internet. Sometimes I venture out and try to find other blogs to follow and there is just so much negativity out there!

  48. LOVE this post so much! it rings so true for me and my friendships, especially since babies have come into the picture (and probably because i’m 34 and a new-ish mama). lately, i meet up for walks or a yoga class with my gal pals and it’s liberating not to have to plan or think too much about it. for walks, my babe is contained in his stroller and i not only get some much needed girl time, i also am getting fresh air and exercise. i don’t mind the brevity of spending time together because when you know you’ve only got a limited amount of time you just cut to the important stuff. – Julie

  49. Like becoming friends with your kids’ friends’ parents!

  50. This is so spot on I can’t even tell you. Sometimes I feel like I have no friends anymore, but this article reminded me that I have plenty of friends! Just cuz we don’t spend every Saturday night together getting sloshed until 3am does not make me friendless. The 15 minutes before and after the show or movie and the walk over the bridge to work are my 30s version of weekend benders. :)

  51. Sadie’s comment about RIGHT NOW is spot on… Anytime I try to plan ahead to do dinner or whatever, something inevitably comes up (one of the babies gets sick or blah blah blah), but my good friends know they can always call and see if I’m up for a walk or an errand or a quick outing immediately. It doesn’t always work out, but so often it does! Love the spontaneous little dates!

  52. Yes! This couldn’t ring truer to me! My friend and I wanted to hang today in between my baby girl’s nap time, so she came with me to have some photos printed and to pick up some mother’s day cards. That turned into having lunch and we had the best time! Definitely helpful when friends can adapt to tricky schedules. I appreciate it so much!

  53. YES! And lots of working out together.

  54. It’s so true that the time you have to devote to friendship changes as your life changes…

    I’ve found that pleasant errands (used book store! Farmers market! Etc) and walks or cups of coffee ( can be scheduled at unexpected times and focus on the other person instead of focusing on a distraction like a move…) are really great for keeping friends close when you really can’t make the time for dinners, evenings out, or more involved things.

    It’s not an all-or-nothing deal, basically. We all do what we can with what we have. :)

  55. This past week a friend and I met up for a quick mid-work day walk around the farmers’ market between our offices. It was nice to have a reason to get together without any frills or big plans, just plain old catching up while browsing through a tower of potted herb plants. While I’m all about planning occasions to get together with friends, the impromptu get togethers are my favorite.

    – Alexa

  56. I’m 32 and single and I looooooove my friends. I do both! I have dinner dates with the girls, I go to the gym with a couple friends, I go to book club with a whole crew, I make dinner with some friends, I go Christmas shopping with a friend, I watch TV with friends, and I have weirdly intimate email relationships with some friends I don’t see all the time. (I also have an intense couple of group texts that I’m on… which is probably a whole other post.) Ha! Honesty, I feel so fortunate to have smart/ funny / strong /savvy ladies around me… I’d do anything to see them as much as possible!

  57. Really interesting observation! I’m 29 and like to schedule dinners or drinks still but if I find my girlfriends and I are having a hard time making time I always suggest a walk or run in the park. We can work out and socialize at the same time and it makes us both feel awesome after! I’m not sure I could grocery shop with someone though, I like that ‘me’ time where I can shop without any guilt whatsoever and splurge on things like pine nuts or a special jar of jam because we “need” them. I like some of the other ideas in the comments, especially the ‘right now’ suggestion :)

  58. Love this! I’m still in my twenties and doing my organized dinners etc. but i TOTALLY feel that it is unnatural. There is a lot less of the laying around in our parents house than in highschool or in dorm rooms in college, a lot less of even visiting each others apartments just to say hi (I think due to a lot of us living with boyfriends/girlfriends and being in serious relationships) and a lot more of formal get togethers. Looking forward to the thirties where the informal becomes the norm again. Thanks for sharing! I would love to see a post on making new friends in your late twenties/thirties, especially if you are in a new city.

  59. This is a great idea. I’ll propose it next time we meet with my friends.
    We always get together for coffee and tea, but since it isn’t possible to do this often (small children mamas) we end up meeting once every two months, at best. So bad!


  60. I like this. I feel this way about calls and emails, too. It’s nice to write a long email to a friend or stay on the phone for an hour, but it’s not always possible. Sometimes, the two or three line email check-in or brief hang-out is just as meaningful and keeps the thread of the friendship going strong even during busy moments.

  61. Going to Target has somehow become the best friend activity in the few hours I have to spare after work. #Truth

  62. That’s quite interesting. I never really thought of it like that. I do a variety of things with my friends, and we have known each other long enough that going for a quick walk or to a fancy restaurant is fine… just depends on what works that particular day. I am soon to be in my 30s, and I think having kids definitely changes the picture a bit. I sort of imagined it would be like you describe once I have a kid or a close friend has a kid. I guess I will find out! It’s a bit weird that no one close to me has started breeding yet lol. Casual acquaintances have, of course… but not my close friends. I imagine there will still be a mix of plans and spontaneous outings (I am a planner so most of my outing are not spontaneous anyway). I like the idea that it’s ok to not do anything fancy with your friends, but it’s not really anything new to me. I think if you’re in similar life situations, it can also bring you closer (e.g. you both have young kids and take them to the playground). I also think that you make time for what’s important to you… I wouldn’t want my friend to always have to tag along with my screaming toddler, for instance… someone can babysit :) Balance!

  63. L says...

    I like the idea of this, and as I approach 30 I’ve definitely seen this more and more. I guess I’m wondering how you make that initial connection, though? I just moved to a new city and work with all guys… So how do women meet each other outside of work or college?

  64. I sort of agree with this. The ease of having a “quickie” moment with a friend is definitely liberating, because we both understand our time constraints. On the other hand, carving out time for an intimate dinner/lunch/brunch is equally as important. It may not happen often, but it reminds us that our relationship is not an afterthought or a chore.

  65. YES. I now totally understand why you always see moms in pairs at the farmer’s market. My husband is an academic and we have had to move a lot. I have found that the only way to survive is to totally throw myself at potential friends. I’ve gone from introverted and careful to super-slutty for friends! Did we have a nice chat? Let’s go to the Y together! Are our kids in the same activity? Let’s go thrift-shopping for size 3T shirts! Come over and let’s get a pizza and drink beer while our children fight each other! My house is a disaster; let’s be friends!

    Sometimes the best way to get other parents to hang is to call them up and suggest doing something RIGHT NOW rather than try to schedule anything. It works, and I kind of love it.

  66. This is an amazing article! I think it speaks a lot of truth in female friendships in busy times… I feel like men bond so much quicker, easier, and there’s less of a guard, especially over sports ;)

  67. Oh and I agree, I have found that doing activities together is such a better way to have long lasting friendships :)

  68. Awww, i’m making all my girlfriends read this :) Wonderful post!

  69. I think this article is super depressing. Especially the part about the friend that goes to plays and they just take 15 minutes to talk about things quickly. I think it is a problem that people are looking for outs on personal connections. I am 29 and I go on impromptu walks or to happy hours with friends. I also host everyone for dinners or meet out for dinners that are scheduled. However, I am very lucky in that most of my friends live in the same city, but I think I would go crazy if I didn’t have plans with them at least once a week.

    • DCMama says...

      Not sure of your situation, but I think it just changes when you have more obligations like work, marriage, little ones (really does it). I think short encounters are more feasible than arranging babysitting all the time and better than nothing. Everyone’s situation is different though. I wish I had more time for friends, but am happy being a new mom and there is a time for everything. I found friends were always busy with happy hours, work events, etc even sans kids and married.

  70. I maintain some of my closest friendships with letter writing. Not emailing, not necessarily even texting (though we do do that on occasion)—but good old-fashioned letters. It’s the equivalent of our old “long talks,” but on whatever schedule works for each of us. Weirdly, I’ve been able to keep friends closer this way although physically they’re farther away; friends who do live closer I actually tend to lose touch with because they are close-ish proximity-wise, but not close enough to do things and just hang out with—with them I often do have to schedule a dinner out! Sometimes in lieu of that we’ll go for a hike or something, though. :)

  71. Just yesterday I spent the afternoon with my friend running errands on foot with out littles. Way less pressure than making a dedicated ‘date’ ahead of time! Just sharing pieces of real life together. Love this post :) although I am not sure the age categories work for everyone. I’m still in my twenties but very far from all-nighters and tons of time on my hands.

  72. i found this to be one of the best things about having a dog — you end up making all these friendships where you get to meet people and then go for walks together. my closest friends are now actually my dog walking friends. :)